Monday morning local time, North Korea has popped another underground nuclear test. No word on yield or leaks. In fact few sites to cite at the moment. Stay tuned.
North Korea Pops a Nuke
Monday morning local time, North Korea has popped another underground nuclear test. No word on yield or leaks. In fact few sites to cite at the moment. Stay tuned.
Just assume that everything I say is sarcastic.
Re: North Korea Pops a Nuke
Really early stuff, but BBC has a story.
Well, back on the terrorism blacklist goes North Korea, I imagine.
Something tells me we haven't seen the last of foreshadowing.
Re: North Korea Pops a Nuke
I think we did very well with absolute silence in the face of their last temper tantrum, where they demanded an apology for our condemnation of their missile tests or they'd test a nuke. Sure, they tested a nuke, as they threatened. But AT NO POINT should we now bend and run back to them, or they will definitely see it as capitulation.
Frankly, I'd like to see us announce that we no longer believe that we can negotiate in good faith with a regime that has proven untrustworthy. That we will no longer bargain away aid and succor for agreements that will not be honored.
I reserve the right to be bothered by things that don't faze you,
and to cheerfully ignore things that bug the shit out of you.
I am not you.
Re: North Korea Pops a Nuke
Like Chimera said, all they do is build up something all threatening looking, test a bomb or missile to show that they're a big kid now, then come to the table to demand concessions to stop. We give them concessions and they go along with it for a bit then decide to do another test or cut off the economic zone and all communications lines for a month.. Then they come back to the table.
Concessions and several party talks work fine with rational nation states, but this one is a big version of a bratty four year old and we're the mother who gives him cookies and milk to calm him down from a temper tantrum.
Re: North Korea Pops a Nuke
It's funny how old Sheriff Uncle Sam wants individuals to have the right to bear arms and protect themselves, but when it comes to other countries having the same right, he starts getting all butthurt!
To sleep, perchance to experience amygdalocortical activation and prefrontal deactivation.
Re: North Korea Pops a Nuke
If you knew jack about the North Korean regime, you wouldn't be trying to derail this thread with tired anti-American screeds.
I reserve the right to be bothered by things that don't faze you,
and to cheerfully ignore things that bug the shit out of you.
I am not you.
Re: North Korea Pops a Nuke
Some fella with a girly name, not very nice to his people, might want to take over the world at some point. What damn fool would let them get hold of nuclear weaponry?
Oh, the one-time custodians of atomic destruction, that's who. Don't worry, it's nothing personal; I just think your elected officials have got a lot to answer for.
To sleep, perchance to experience amygdalocortical activation and prefrontal deactivation.
Re: North Korea Pops a Nuke
I agree with Ivan to a point - the US doesn't have any legs left to stand on to be criticizing how any other countries conduct their business at this point. On the other hand, I don't much like the idea of North Korea waving their nuclear weapons around and threatening the rest of us with them.
Re: North Korea Pops a Nuke
Originally posted by ivan astikov
I can agree with you about holding our elected officials (and former elected officials, and former appointed officials, too.) accountable for actions that were beyond the laws of the US. Though, I would caution people living in glass houses to be careful about throwing stones.
None of that makes me happy to see North Korea working so feverishly on a nuclear weapons program.
Re: North Korea Pops a Nuke
Screw it. Nuke the fuckers and be done with it.
"The Turtle Moves!"
Re: North Korea Pops a Nuke
Based on what I've seen of North Korea, I'd say there's a fair chance that if we just leave them to their own devices, they'll eventually do the job for us.
Re: North Korea Pops a Nuke
Pretty much so. Their government acts like a spoiled 4 year old demanding attention, and we shouldn't give it to them.
Pop 21 million.
Army: 1 million. 4,000 tanks, 18,000 artillery pieces.
Millions starving, including millions dying of starvation less than 10 years ago.
Why?
Because it's a military/hereditary regime that can't support it's own people but seeks desperately to cling to power for the benefit of the very few. The only way they can do this is by closing themselves off to the rest of the world and filling their people will lies about how it's actually WORSE outside their own country, how their country is respected in the larger world, how they're in the vanguard of human advancement.
Because if their population knew the whole truth, there'd be commissars hanging from every lamp post.
I reserve the right to be bothered by things that don't faze you,
and to cheerfully ignore things that bug the shit out of you.
I am not you.
Re: North Korea Pops a Nuke
Oh, and Ivan, I have a serious problem with hearing anti-American "you have a lot to answer for" bullshit from a Brit. You folks have a few hundred years on us when it comes to fucking up the larger world for the benefit of your own country. The fact that your country is not in a position to keep doing it to most of the world doesn't mean that you're not still doing it where you can.
So shut your cake hole, Mr. Glass Castle.
I reserve the right to be bothered by things that don't faze you,
and to cheerfully ignore things that bug the shit out of you.
I am not you.
Re: North Korea Pops a Nuke
That's the spirit, Chimera!
It's good to see you've still got that whole "yee-har-NASCAR-wild-west-frontier-let's-kick-ass" attitude that's always served you so well!
To sleep, perchance to experience amygdalocortical activation and prefrontal deactivation.
Re: North Korea Pops a Nuke
You must not have read what Chimera just said. Let's try it again:That's the spirit, Chimera!
It's good to see you've still got that whole "yee-har-NASCAR-wild-west-frontier-let's-kick-ass" attitude that's always served you so well!Now respond to what he said. (Can't believe I have to explain this process to you.)
Re: North Korea Pops a Nuke
I think the US needs to wait at least another six months before they get on their high horse about anything. The scars are all still too fresh.
Re: North Korea Pops a Nuke
Point out where I've ever said my country is beyond reproach and I might entertain you.You must not have read what Chimera just said. Let's try it again:That's the spirit, Chimera!
It's good to see you've still got that whole "yee-har-NASCAR-wild-west-frontier-let's-kick-ass" attitude that's always served you so well!Now respond to what he said. (Can't believe I have to explain this process to you.)
To sleep, perchance to experience amygdalocortical activation and prefrontal deactivation.
Re: North Korea Pops a Nuke
This is the point at which I am going to report my own post with the intention of asking the Mods to split out the anti-American derail bullshit to it's own thread, so that the original thread, about NORTH KOREA, can continue without it.
I reserve the right to be bothered by things that don't faze you,
and to cheerfully ignore things that bug the shit out of you.
I am not you.
Re: North Korea Pops a Nuke
What I don't get is what China gets out of all this. They're the ones who keep propping up NK. If they ever just cut the rail line, the game's over. NK is a global embarrassment to them, so why don't they deal with them and gather a ton of goodwill. It would also "free" up NK to Chinese "exploitation," as they bring them into this century.
"The Turtle Moves!"
Re: North Korea Pops a Nuke
If NK falls, then China has to deal with large numbers of refugees, as well as a united Korea that is allied with America and includes American troops - right on their border.
Never mind that I personally think that within 5-10 years, we'd be asked to leave and there would be a far more pragmatic government in Seoul that realized that their one and only land border was with the most populous nation on Earth, an emerging Superpower and #2 (and perhaps one day #1) economy. Think Finland after WWII.
That and it could get really really messy in NK as various factions either fight against either in a sort of Civil War, or deliberately start a war with SK.
I reserve the right to be bothered by things that don't faze you,
and to cheerfully ignore things that bug the shit out of you.
I am not you.
Re: North Korea Pops a Nuke
They get another Communist buddy. Cuba's a bit far away to have drinks with on a Friday night.
Why won't those stupid idiots let me join their crappy club for jerks?
Re: North Korea Pops a Nuke
What we really have to fear is the very real wet dream of a militaristic, xenophobic and paranoid regime that nurses very long grudges.
1> Launch nukes at American bases in Guam, South Korea and Japan in order to cripple the American Military in the region and limit our potential to respond.
2> Launch nukes at Japan to strike back for their colonial humiliation.
3> Launch a nuke at the continental US to humiliate us, if at all possible.
4> Roll their overwhelming military into South Korea in a lightning strike to reunited the country under their control.
5> Then sit back, having reunited the country, crippled and humiliated the USA, injured and humiliated Japan.
6> Proceed to kill several million "war criminals" and "Enemies of the State" in SK.
7> Negotiate Peace on their terms, confident that China will step in and prevent any overwhelming (and much too late) response from the US.
I reserve the right to be bothered by things that don't faze you,
and to cheerfully ignore things that bug the shit out of you.
I am not you.
Re: North Korea Pops a Nuke
If the West sticks its oars into Korea's murky waters, they will be accused of ongoing imperialism. If China sticks its oar in, they will be viewed as bullying next-door neighbours.
If diplomacy fails and physical force is necessary, it needs to be done by as wide a representation of allied countries as possible so that all post-hostility is shared among as big a base as possible, stretching their resources to the max, or we need to finance one crazy little nation into having an army that sorts out all world trouble spots and are that bad ass that nobody would dare to take them on without the backing of the allied nations..
To sleep, perchance to experience amygdalocortical activation and prefrontal deactivation.
Re: North Korea Pops a Nuke
What China (and Russia) get from egging Lil' Kim on is pretty simple: An over-extended US that implodes in upon itself, leaving them top dogs on the global stage. We do a first strike nuke against NK, the world hates us and slaps sanctions on us. We invade NK, and we have to do it with money borrowed from China (if they let us), under terms and conditions they dictate. That tension you're feeling? That's our Chinese masters tightening the vise our balls are in.
Proud member of the '09 Phanters!K.I.L.L. S.M.U.R.F.S.
Have you ever wondered if your mom kissed you goodnight after giving your dad a blowjob? You are now. "To be second in space is to be second in everything," LBJ
Re: North Korea Pops a Nuke
Didn't Nostradamus have something to say about all this?
To sleep, perchance to experience amygdalocortical activation and prefrontal deactivation.
Re: North Korea Pops a Nuke
North Korea has followed up the nuclear test with a couple of short-range missiles. (BBC story.) That sort of thing really gets people's attention.
Re: North Korea Pops a Nuke
In much the same way as when a toddler throws his spagetti on the floor.
I reserve the right to be bothered by things that don't faze you,
and to cheerfully ignore things that bug the shit out of you.
I am not you.
Re: North Korea Pops a Nuke
So, we don't want to punish the N.K populace for having a nutty leadership, or do we? With the combined resources and intelligence of the developed and keen to develop nations, is there really no way we cannot just take off the Hydra's heads in one swipe? Who would object if we dropped a bomb on Kim Il-Sung's current residence?
To sleep, perchance to experience amygdalocortical activation and prefrontal deactivation.
Re: North Korea Pops a Nuke
What is this crap? China and North Korea aren't allies, they never will be. If anything China would love to come in and "liberate" the oppressed peoples of North Korea.
Launching nukes on anyone is a good way to get your entire country put against a wall. It's standard policy. North Korea could have every ally they could dream of but the second they used a nuclear weapon those allies would jump ship like your mother on fleet week.
Also lolz at "Roll their overwhelming military into South Korea". I mean now that we're just going to imaginary create a competent military for North Korea and all.
Re: North Korea Pops a Nuke
We don't care about North Korea. If the UK wants to go to North Korea feel free, but likely they like everyone else know what North Korea really is. A stupid paper tiger that couldn't hurt anyone if they tried. I'd rather just let the Chinese or South Koreans deal with it one day. Why they haven't already is at least a lot more interesting questions then the crazy theories above my post.
Re: North Korea Pops a Nuke
The PDRK has announced it is no longer bound by the Armistice and any effort to stop its ships at sea would result in a military strike on the ROK.
Just assume that everything I say is sarcastic.
Re: North Korea Pops a Nuke
Probably everyone living in Seoul, who would shortly after get a taste of North Korean artillery. And yes, NK would get their asses handed to them in a war, but they'd take a lot of people down with them.
Re: North Korea Pops a Nuke
Tell that to Chairman Mao.Mao Tse-tung once famously said that the relationship between China and North Korea was as close as "lips and teeth." Throughout the decades, China has remained the truest friend of its isolated neighbor -- at times the only friend.
Successive U.S. presidents have tried to take advantage of that relationship, turning to Beijing in the hope that it can pressure Pyongyang to give up its nuclear program. Increasingly, China itself is questioning whether the relationship is worth the effort.
Within the Chinese intelligentsia there is a deep divide over how to handle North Korea. The Global Times, a newspaper with close party ties, Tuesday published a survey of 20 of the country's top foreign policy experts. It found them split down the middle -- 10 arguing for tough sanctions against North Korea, 10 opposed.
"Traditionally, China has been very friendly to North Korea, but now there is a feeling that the North Koreans are causing us too much trouble," Zhang said.
Proud member of the '09 Phanters!
Have you ever wondered if your mom kissed you goodnight after giving your dad a blowjob? You are now. "To be second in space is to be second in everything," LBJ
Re: North Korea Pops a Nuke
poop, i learned something i didn't know today.
Re: North Korea Pops a Nuke
I do that every day, but I forget it by the following morning.
What was this thread about, again?
To sleep, perchance to experience amygdalocortical activation and prefrontal deactivation.
Re: North Korea Pops a Nuke
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid= ... refer=home
Everybody give North Korea a round of applause, they've managed to tick off the giant country next door to them. I think this probably assures the security of South Korea more than anything we could have done.China Suspends North Korea Exchanges, Yonhap Reports (Update1)
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By Kyung Bok Cho and Dune Lawrence
June 1 (Bloomberg) -- China suspended government exchanges with North Korea after Kim Jong-Il’s regime last week tested a nuclear device and fired short-range missiles, Yonhap News said.
China has halted plans to send officials to North Korea and won’t accept visits from Kim’s government either, the Korean- language news agency said today, citing unidentified diplomatic sources in Beijing.
China’s foreign ministry has said the country “resolutely opposes” North Korea’s nuclear test. China on May 25 agreed with the U.S., Japan and Russia to work toward a United Nations Security Council resolution censuring North Korea. The U.S. and Japan want the statement to call for cutting the communist country’s global financial ties, UN diplomats said.
China’s foreign ministry didn’t immediately respond to a faxed request for comment today.
Re: North Korea Pops a Nuke
I have little doubt that China was given at least some foreign encouragement towards this decision and announcement. Doing something doesn't have to be flashy or obvious.
To be honest, I wonder whether this may be the first step towards a collapse of the current regime. I don't know what the financial figures are, but my impression had been that one of the things that has kept North Korea as functional as it is has been the support (economic, military, and agricultural) that it gets from China, as well as anything else it can get from the rest of the global community.
If China is as annoyed as they sound, that might be going away.
Granted, short-term, that might be a disaster for both North and South Korea. But in the long run, only a real change in North Korea's government is going to improve things for the people there.
Re: North Korea Pops a Nuke
Right after NK popped the nuke I've read somewhere some expert saying that it can only mean one of two things: either Kim went insane, or all this is just a show for the internal politics purpose, presumably related to succession.
And now, a week later, what I see on the news? N Korea 'names Kim's successor'.
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