A Kinda Half-Assed Apology From Ed, Sorta Thing

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Originally posted by Johnny

In that case, it's safe to assume that he's following this and other discussions.

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Maybe, maybe not:

Last visited: Tue Mar 03, 2009 3:25 pm

Maybe he has one of his minions checking this place occasionally to see what's going on. Maybe he's viewing anonymously. (I just loaded this board in another browser and could see our other-board subforum.)

And if he is checking it, what of it? He sees that we aren't pretending we hate him but that if anything, we're being nice because we don't want to get banned (I don't at least; I still get to search every five minutes)?

If what he's seen on the other board isn't enough, nothing he sees here is going to do a damn. And if what he's seen on the other board is enough (which I doubt), nothing he sees here is going to add much.

Let him read. Let him post. Let him defend himself here, where we can tell him how we really feel without having to censor ourselves because ooh, someone told him to fuck himself.

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So why hasn't he rescinded his silly rules?

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Because in a dictatorship, the surest way to lose your power is to give up any of it.

Zotti changes anything back to how it was, and people will want more. (And rightfully so. It isn't his board alone.)

He doesn't want that. He wants to do what he sees fit, even if it means lots of people leave. Lots of people left during P2P1 (first pay-up) and more after P2P2, when it became quite clear that the administration didn't give a shit if you were a guest or a client.

At this point, he has invested so much in the idea that he is not a destructive force that I'm not sure anything will get him to stop tinkering.

(And in this experience, I am beginning to understand much more deeply why people argue for smaller government.)

Maybe the user name is just some joker, and not Ed at all.

Well, I posted my reply, for what it's worth.

Not even a warning for me. Interesting. Ed closing the thread without any attempt to defend Skip is probably as close to a public spanking as any mod is likely to get.

I just wanted to thank Borborygmi for the Art Gallery link. I downloaded the page for posterity. Too bad they mangled it when it was restored to the server. If anyone has a fix for that, my gratitude would be eternal.

NineToTheSky, I'm sure that you are unaware of the irony in calling me "a master of smilies". Being the old-fashioned curmudgeon that I am, I eschew smilies utterly. Many's the SDer who tried to lure me over to the dark side of emoticon useage. My curmudgeonly inclinations further force me to creatively pervert such frippery whenever the opportunity presents itself. Ergo, the Art Gallery. Also, for instance, take the following images:

http://i240.photobucket.com/albums/ff61 ... age002.jpg

http://i240.photobucket.com/albums/ff61 ... e002-1.jpg

http://i240.photobucket.com/albums/ff61 ... e002-2.jpg

http://i240.photobucket.com/albums/ff61 ... e002-6.jpg

All of them were created using Excel, yes, Excel the spreadsheet program. It is difficult to describe the pleasure of listening to my Microsoft Office application grind away as I bend it to my will. Should anyone feel inclined to accuse me of having dangerous amounts of spare time, I direct your attention to some Japanese loons who have created fully animated Excel versions of PacMan and Space Invaders.

http://roysworld.co.uk/?p=2725

I don't even want to think of the macros required to do that!

We now return you to your regularly scheduled thread.

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Originally posted by Jill

Well, I posted my reply, for what it's worth.

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I'm sure the CL accountants are on it, calculating exactly that.

(Of the overall ten best posters, you're probably on the list. All I hope at this point is that WE don't lose you.)

You won't. And thank you for the compliment (I think? -- what's with the 'probably' disclaimer? ;) )

After the initial non-apology I almost felt sorry for Ed. It was obvious that he noticed that things were going wrong. There was a small chance that he was just very inapt at expressing actual contrition.
Now it becomes obvious that it was just more of the same shit that we always got.

Whenever the negative reactions are overwhelming we get half an apology, the suggestion to fuck off and get some fresh air until we forget about Ed's failure and no actual change at all.

Ed, I hope you live happily ever after as a private person, but may you pay dearly for everything you did on that board.

The issue to me is that I already have an on line place where I can debate but must remain polite to other posters (Una). And it's presented as such- must be polite. Not bullshit like "you can say anything you want except these 5 phrases (or whatever)" "Fuck you" doesn't offend me. I was far more offended by accusations of being a terrorist appoligist or traitor. So, the issue isn't
"don't be rude to other posters" but rather "don't use this set of terms directly to other posters, but you can use them to anyone else and say anyother really offensive thing to them"

It reminds me of the other rule I objected to in the pit - the 'no calling folks trolls' as if that was the most offensive thing evah.

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Originally posted by Oakminster

Not even a warning for me. Interesting. Ed closing the thread without any attempt to defend Skip is probably as close to a public spanking as any mod is likely to get.

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Skipmagic, sweetie, the grown-ups are talking. If you can sit down and be quiet over there until we're finished, Daddy will buy you some toy soldiers and then can tell them what to do.

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Originally posted by Jill

Well, I posted my reply, for what it's worth.

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Good post, Jill. One of the most frustrating things for me in this whole mess is so many posters thinking this is just about two rules in the Pit and thinking that they don't go to the Pit much, so it won't affect them*, and me not really being able to express what my gut and my head are telling me (that what is going on is a Bad Thing, but not really knowing why). You expressed very nicely why it is such a bad thing for our community.

*It might not affect them yet, but it will, in many different ways.

ETA: Okay, two of the most frustrating things.

Well, featherlou, in my half century I've had my nose rubbed in the fact that MOST people don't see the wider implications of ANYTHING and insist on focusing on the microcosm while the macrocosm goes totally to shit in a shoulder bag. Nits abound, and nitpickers to pick them, and trying to get them up to speed with what's REALLY going on is an exercise in explaining cosmology to a coliform... Forest, trees, that sort of thing...

What is wrong with Scylla. I know I am not a great writer, but how is it possible to miss the fact my long OP and followups and most of the other posts by other posters are not about the silliness of the dirty word list?

http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/sho ... tcount=167

I think he posts drunk or stoned sometimes.

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Originally posted by Liberal

I think he posts drunk or stoned sometimes.

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I think that's probably it.

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Originally posted by Scylla

It should be inherently obvious that some of the extreme and hateful behavior presents possible problems for Ed and whatever company happens to own this place at the moment. At times this place has had spillover into the real world. Suppose somebody kills themself because of a feud here? Suppose they kill somebody else? Suppose somebody loses a job because of something somebody says here?

Some of the particularly hateful behavior here may cross legal lines. Is it verbal assault? What if it demonstrably damages somebody?

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Has anyone actually provided a link to one of these nasty outbursts of virulent verbosity and expletives?

Scylla is a goddamn self-indulgent, arrogant, ass. He's one of the fucktards I'll be glad to be away from. Cunt.

I think he is a hypocritical, disingenuous cock. That might have something to do with it.

To be fair, ivan, I think they might be referencing private emails from posters to staff. I'd think that there would be an appreciable amount, and some people are just rude, no matter who they're communicating with.

I believe Veb alluded to this earlier (in a different thread).

Hmm. Scylla seems to be a big hit with the ladies.

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Originally posted by ivan astikov

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Originally posted by Scylla

It should be inherently obvious that some of the extreme and hateful behavior presents possible problems for Ed and whatever company happens to own this place at the moment. At times this place has had spillover into the real world. Suppose somebody kills themself because of a feud here? Suppose they kill somebody else? Suppose somebody loses a job because of something somebody says here?

Some of the particularly hateful behavior here may cross legal lines. Is it verbal assault? What if it demonstrably damages somebody?

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Has anyone actually provided a link to one of these nasty outbursts of virulent verbosity and expletives?

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Well, in order to do so the assertion would have to have some, like, validity or something. :roll: Yah, good luck wid dat...

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Originally posted by ivan astikov

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Originally posted by Scylla

It should be inherently obvious that some of the extreme and hateful behavior presents possible problems for Ed and whatever company happens to own this place at the moment. At times this place has had spillover into the real world. Suppose somebody kills themself because of a feud here? Suppose they kill somebody else? Suppose somebody loses a job because of something somebody says here?

Some of the particularly hateful behavior here may cross legal lines. Is it verbal assault? What if it demonstrably damages somebody?

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Has anyone actually provided a link to one of these nasty outbursts of virulent verbosity and expletives?

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Well, there WAS that whole Stage Manager thing. There was definitely some potential for legal fallout there. I'm not sure that the SDMB admins particularly want that put forth as an example however.

Okay, this may be controversial and touchy. Beware.

I'm a little bit confused about what What Exit is attempting to do over there. It seems like a lot of rope-a-dope and pulled punches to me, but I'm sure he can explain. He and I have had our differences, but he is so good natured that he wouldn't let things go until we kissed and made up — which I'm glad we did, but he still seems to have that really really driving urge to facilitate and mitigate. And so, there's a lot of "Bad Ed! Bad Dex! Bad mods! Here's what you did wrong! I keep hoping you'll respond the right way so I can come back."

I don't know. What Exit? What gives? What are you trying to accomplish over there. Are you pretty much just biding your time until you try to work things out among everyone?

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Originally posted by What Exit?

What is wrong with Scylla. I know I am not a great writer, but how is it possible to miss the fact my long OP and followups and most of the other posts by other posters are not about the silliness of the dirty word list?

http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/sho ... tcount=167

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I don't know why people are unwilling to admit this, but Scylla is a fucking idiot. This is just more evidence.

And his tedious fucking stories are not good. Anyone who things those things constitute good writing is also dumb.

Scylla's stupid fucking attitude, as expressed in that horrible post of his, makes me start to wonder if all the political theorists are right who have proposed that right-wing ideology is based upon a maladjusted desire to have an omnipotent authority over them. It certainly describes him to a T. What a complete fuckup he is.

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Originally posted by Excalibre

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Originally posted by What Exit?

What is wrong with Scylla. I know I am not a great writer, but how is it possible to miss the fact my long OP and followups and most of the other posts by other posters are not about the silliness of the dirty word list?

http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/sho ... tcount=167

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I don't know why people are unwilling to admit this, but Scylla is a fucking idiot. This is just more evidence.

And his tedious fucking stories are not good. Anyone who things those things constitute good writing is also dumb.

Scylla's stupid fucking attitude, as expressed in that horrible post of his, makes me start to wonder if all the political theorists are right who have proposed that right-wing ideology is based upon a maladjusted desire to have an omnipotent authority over them. It certainly describes him to a T. What a complete fuckup he is.

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Waitwaitwaitwaitwhat?

You are not the same Shodan that I remember.

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Originally posted by pedescribe

Waitwaitwaitwaitwhat?

You are not the same Shodan that I remember.

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Well, I was visited by these three ghosts one night . . .

Regards,
Excalibre

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Originally posted by Liberal

Okay, this may be controversial and touchy. Beware.

I'm a little bit confused about what What Exit is attempting to do over there. It seems like a lot of rope-a-dope and pulled punches to me, but I'm sure he can explain. He and I have had our differences, but he is so good natured that he wouldn't let things go until we kissed and made up — which I'm glad we did, but he still seems to have that really really driving urge to facilitate and mitigate. And so, there's a lot of "Bad Ed! Bad Dex! Bad mods! Here's what you did wrong! I keep hoping you'll respond the right way so I can come back."

I don't know. What Exit? What gives? What are you trying to accomplish over there. Are you pretty much just biding your time until you try to work things out among everyone?

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I not leaving the Dope. I am unhappy with what has been going on but I actually still hope they can fix the Dope. I tried to find the politest way to strongly give my opinion. I will mostly be here it looks like. If Ed can find a way to work with the community I think he can still right the ship. I also found the thread was my way of venting. I am not especially looking to go back but I also don't want to see the Dope collapse. I don't consider this an Us vs. Them situation, in fact it feels too much like an Us vs. Us situation.

I don't think I actually complained about Dex did I? I did clearly but politely complain about the Modding of Ed and Lynn in the pit.

Does that help? Even to me it looks disjointed.
Maybe I should just say I am not sure what I am trying to accomplish other than venting. I know my venting does not measure up to any typical venting rants.
Beside it cannot hurt to retain a cordial relationship between all three boards. I think I've been consistent in saying that from the start.

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Originally posted by Excalibre

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Originally posted by What Exit?

What is wrong with Scylla. I know I am not a great writer, but how is it possible to miss the fact my long OP and followups and most of the other posts by other posters are not about the silliness of the dirty word list?

http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/sho ... tcount=167

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I don't know why people are unwilling to admit this, but Scylla is a fucking idiot. This is just more evidence.

And his tedious fucking stories are not good. Anyone who things those things constitute good writing is also dumb.

Scylla's stupid fucking attitude, as expressed in that horrible post of his, makes me start to wonder if all the political theorists are right who have proposed that right-wing ideology is based upon a maladjusted desire to have an omnipotent authority over them. It certainly describes him to a T. What a complete fuckup he is.

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I can think of two brilliant posts by him that really intrigued me but you are correct that the rest is usually unreadable to me. His classic Blimp story was just great to read and his Water-boarding experiment was crazy but very interesting. I do think he is smart, given that he came back and admitted he was mistaken in his categorization of my Op shows he can listen to reason when not just attacked. I know I can be annoying and infuriating at times but I try to find the positive in people and posters. I have very few exceptions.

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Originally posted by What Exit?

I can think of two brilliant posts by him that really intrigued me but you are correct that the rest is usually unreadable to me. His classic Blimp story was just great to read and his Water-boarding experiment was crazy but very interesting. I do think he is smart, given that he came back and admitted he was mistaken in his categorization of my Op shows he can listen to reason when not just attacked. I know I can be annoying and infuriating at times but I try to find the positive in people and posters. I have very few exceptions.

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It's not anything about his intelligence, really. I just find this one more in a long line of examples of how utterly defective his attitude is. This immediate leap to defense of any action by an authority figure, with the knee-jerk declaration that Ed wouldn't have to do this if everyone on the SDMB hadn't forced him, is just so screwed up.

I mean for God's sake. The average quilting circle is more rough and tumble than the SDMB was. It's like he's operating under the assumption that no matter what, whatever any authority figure does must be correct. It's so defective.

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Originally posted by Excalibre

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Originally posted by What Exit?

I can think of two brilliant posts by him that really intrigued me but you are correct that the rest is usually unreadable to me. His classic Blimp story was just great to read and his Water-boarding experiment was crazy but very interesting. I do think he is smart, given that he came back and admitted he was mistaken in his categorization of my Op shows he can listen to reason when not just attacked. I know I can be annoying and infuriating at times but I try to find the positive in people and posters. I have very few exceptions.

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It's not anything about his intelligence, really. I just find this one more in a long line of examples of how utterly defective his attitude is. This immediate leap to defense of any action by an authority figure, with the knee-jerk declaration that Ed wouldn't have to do this if everyone on the SDMB hadn't forced him, is just so screwed up.

I mean for God's sake. The average quilting circle is more rough and tumble than the SDMB was. It's like he's operating under the assumption that no matter what, whatever any authority figure does must be correct. It's so defective.

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Well this part I can agree with. His post still puzzles me and I do not agree with it. I rarely curse on-line. I try hard not to IRL. My friends at work that I play cards with tease me for my fudges and darns. I sure as heck don't need anyone protecting me from being cursed at or seeing curse words. To go even further and say we can use these offensive words but not towards each other just left me thoroughly confused. Either ban the words completely or not at all.

Of course this was still minor compared to Lynn baiting Sapo and trumping up the charges to suspend him and for the technical and communication problems.

Colibri's butthurt complaint made him and Ed look very foolish and it was a terrible place they put themself.

Did I mention the tech failures? The inability to make fixes to the search engine bothers me to no end.

Well, in fairness, Colibri is in Panama, and in Panama, challenging the actions of a moderator on an internet message board is traditionally regarded as sufficient cause for a knife fight.

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Originally posted by Excalibre

It's like he's operating under the assumption that no matter what, whatever any authority figure does must be correct. It's so defective.

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A certain kind of person thrives under an authority, and a lot of Republicans are exactly that type. I'm not saying it's automatically a character flaw (my hubby leans that way actually), but there are things about it which make me uneasy. There's a word for it by I can't recall it right now. The smarter ones know when to question it (authority).

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Originally posted by ivan astikov

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Originally posted by Scylla

It should be inherently obvious that some of the extreme and hateful behavior presents possible problems for Ed and whatever company happens to own this place at the moment. At times this place has had spillover into the real world. Suppose somebody kills themself because of a feud here? Suppose they kill somebody else? Suppose somebody loses a job because of something somebody says here?

Some of the particularly hateful behavior here may cross legal lines. Is it verbal assault? What if it demonstrably damages somebody?

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Has anyone actually provided a link to one of these nasty outbursts of virulent verbosity and expletives?

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It is possible that Scylla is being sarcastic of facetious or something.

Here's the thing about that:

If it's not obvious enough, you look like a combination of tool and tool.

And tool is already enough.

If you're trying to be especially clever, you dig in your heels even more when called on your particular brand of "Oh, I am SO CLEVER!"

And thus someone who tries to help you say, "Yeah, I was kind of joking" gets swatted.


Now, I have no deep interest in defending "Scylla is just joking -- trying to get Ed to see the light" -- anyone is welcome to disagree, and that'll be fine. Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe he is actually the SDMB's Don Quixote.

But he's either trying to be artful where artful is wasted or he's just mentally wasted.

Neither one would surprise me much. I never quite got the cult following he had, where if he wrote a sentence it was omg the best sentence ever.

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Originally posted by Liberal

I think he posts drunk or stoned sometimes.

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That's beneath you Lib.

Coming from the guy who complained (rightly) about the "Are you off your meds yet" crack that people were using against you, I expected more.

Until Ed gets that the boards are not about his "vision," nothing is going to change. The boards haven't been about Ed in some time, they have been about us. Coming in and saying that you have a "vision" of how the boards should be (and never laying out a grand overarching vision, just saying, inexplicably at times, "No, that's not what I want.") would piss any group off.

If Ed had been a part of the boards for a significant period of time, he could say that he had a "vision" for the boards, and people wouldn't get angry. If Ed had made a study of the boards and then laid out a vision which codified many things we'd all felt about what the boards should be, but had never formally put down, people would be happy. If Ed had asked Dopers what they think the boards should be, and then engaged in an open debate about those things, people would be happy.

Ed, however, has done none of that, and shows no desire to do that. Which means that he's going to (sooner or later) drive away all but the most sycophantic posters, and it'll be the dullest place on the internet. They might as well change the name at that point to The Stepford Wives Message Board.

Christ, ain't that the problem with newspapers today? They'll give you highly detailed stories about corrupt politicos on the other side of the state, but completely ignore the ones in your area. So much for the honor and nobility of the profession.

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Originally posted by SmartAleq

Well, featherlou, in my half century I've had my nose rubbed in the fact that MOST people don't see the wider implications of ANYTHING and insist on focusing on the microcosm while the macrocosm goes totally to shit in a shoulder bag. Nits abound, and nitpickers to pick them, and trying to get them up to speed with what's REALLY going on is an exercise in explaining cosmology to a coliform... Forest, trees, that sort of thing...

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In my 42 years, I've learned that my instincts are dead-on, and I usually do better when I don't ignore them. :)

(Add me to the list of people who didn't worship at the altar of Scylla. He wrote some good shit, yeah, but every word that flowed from his keyboard wasn't gold. He had some nasty tendencies, and his relationship with his wife was seriously strange.)

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Originally posted by featherlou

and his relationship with his wife was seriously strange.

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Do tell.

Besides the time his wife waterboarded him?

What Exit?

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What is wrong with Scylla. I know I am not a great writer, but how is it possible to miss the fact my long OP and followups and most of the other posts by other posters are not about the silliness of the dirty word list?

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That seems to be standard for him: ignore 99% and mock the remaining 1% as though that were your entire post. Back when I first joined, I thought he was pretty funny, but he quickly turned into a cross between Rush Limbaugh and a drunken frat boy. I washed my hands of him back when he was on his "traitors and cowards" kick during the run-up to the war.

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Originally posted by sublight

That seems to be standard for him: ignore 99% and mock the remaining 1% as though that were your entire post.

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Had to check back to make sure you were talking about Scylla and not puppykicking sonofabitch (previously known as Zotti).

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Originally posted by Excalibre

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Originally posted by featherlou

and his relationship with his wife was seriously strange.

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Do tell.

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I don't recall the details other than I think it had to do with his wife's car, but he posted about pulling a rather cruel practical joke on her, made it one of his usual mega-long stories.

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Originally posted by beebs

Besides the time his wife waterboarded him?

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It was something like that, the first time I noticed that he and his wife had a decidedly strange relationship. They had some kind of dynamic where they were actively mean to each other or something. Different strokes for different folks and all that, and I wouldn't be talking about it if he hadn't volunteered the information, but it weirded me out.

Edit on preview: I think that was it, ETF. Everyone was telling him how brilliant and funny he was, as usual, but I just said it sounded mean, and he didn't like that much.

Ye, I recall he got all indignant and defensive and insisted that he did nothing wrong and she was perfectly happy with it all. The whole thing gave me seriously bad vibes.

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Originally posted by featherlou

Edit on preview: I think that was it, ETF. Everyone was telling him how brilliant and funny he was, as usual, but I just said it sounded mean, and he didn't like that much.

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There was also the time he posted about letting his young (2 years old?) child walk on rather hot (because of the sun) asphalt or concrete because she needed to find out for herself that it was that hot.

I guess that's good parenting to some people.

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Originally posted by Fenris

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Originally posted by Liberal

I think he posts drunk or stoned sometimes.

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That's beneath you Lib.

Coming from the guy who complained (rightly) about the "Are you off your meds yet" crack that people were using against you, I expected more.

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I was relating what I recalled him saying.

OK, normally, I'm much like What Exit? in the "find something nice about everyone" and trying to be a peacekeeper habits. Keeps me fairly Pollyannaish about message board interactions. That, and I have a terribly memory for names, so you can bash my brains in with a brick in one thread and I'll squee over your kitty pics in another simultaneously.

But wasn't Scylla the guy who claims to own his daughter's vagina?

Yeah, that was creepy. I've not been able to enjoy his posts since.

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Originally posted by WhyNot

But wasn't Scylla the guy who claims to own his daughter's vagina?

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If that happened, I don't remember it, which places it either before I got there (possible) or after 2006.

Does anyone have a cite for anything remotely resembling this?

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Originally posted by iampunha

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Originally posted by WhyNot

But wasn't Scylla the guy who claims to own his daughter's vagina?

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If that happened, I don't remember it, which places it either before I got there (possible) or after 2006.

Does anyone have a cite for anything remotely resembling this?

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Yes. Scylla jumps in at post 38 with this:

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Scylla said:
I talked to him anyway, and I told him that as far as I was concerned, anything that went into my daughter's pants belonged to me, and that if he touched her again I would break off his hand and take it off with me.

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It continues to get crazy after that post, which was about a 7 year-old boy playing doctor with his 8 year-old daughter.

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Originally posted by mozg

Yes. Scylla jumps in at post 38 with this:

It continues to get crazy after that post, which was about a 7 year-old boy playing doctor with his 8 year-old daughter.

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Holy shit, what a disturbed, crazy fuck. That's a really messed up way to relate to one's family.

What is going on in the head of someone who finds it so important to be the big alpha dog boss of his family?

ETA: Oh my God, I actually clicked, and he's talking about how hot his daughter is!

What the Christ.

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Originally posted by Liberal

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Originally posted by Fenris

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Originally posted by Liberal

I think he posts drunk or stoned sometimes.

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That's beneath you Lib.

Coming from the guy who complained (rightly) about the "Are you off your meds yet" crack that people were using against you, I expected more.

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I was relating what I recalled him saying.

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For what it's worth (not much, my memory's hit the shitter now I'm 60), I remember him making at least one comment to that effect, in a recent thread.

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Originally posted by Excalibre

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Originally posted by mozg

Yes. Scylla jumps in at post 38 with this:

It continues to get crazy after that post, which was about a 7 year-old boy playing doctor with his 8 year-old daughter.

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Holy shit, what a disturbed, crazy fuck. That's a really messed up way to relate to one's family.

What is going on in the head of someone who finds it so important to be the big alpha dog boss of his family?

ETA: Oh my God, I actually clicked, and he's talking about how hot his daughter is!

What the Christ.

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Yeah it's pretty fucked up that he spends that much time thinking about how much grown men (and apparently also 7 year-old boys) must lust after his 8 year-old daughter because she's tall, blond and beautiful.

Then he goes further off the deep end and talks about how women have to be scared all the time, since no matter where they are they will never be perfectly safe because any man could over power them at any moment.

I appreciate it just as much when someone tells me how scary my life must be as I shudder in fear that every man is a potential rapist as I do when someone tells me that I can't handle being called a cunt.

Scylla and Ed: Two men that should never, ever get anywhere near my cunt.

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Originally posted by mozg

I appreciate it just as much when someone tells me how scary my life must be as I shudder in fear that every man is a potential rapist

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Heh heh heh . . . if I remember correctly, you're catsix, right?