Asking a bride's parents for her hand

I'm sorry, but that's still not an explanation.

Unless you can actually come up with an explanation, I'm going to continue to think there's nothing "manly" or "gentlemanly" or "chivalrous" or "cultured" about doing a historical reenactment of an old custom -- now abandoned in the first world -- hearkening back to a fortunately-abandoned notion of marriage as a contract of purchase. Frankly, and taking your posts into account as the only person who's really endorsed it, it's still bizarre and, so far, inexplicable.

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I manned up and asked him for his permission to marry his daughter.

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Okay, again, stop with the dumb macho bullshit. If you don't have a justification, "man up" and say so. If you do, out with it.

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Originally posted by Zuul

He didn't get her dad's permission because he was taking his property. He did it because he was joining the family and this was a gesture to show that he was serious about being part of the family and would respect whatever traditions that family held. "Being a man" isn't about machismo, but about being a mature adult of the male persuasion.

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I'm sorry, but you offering up a retread of his (thus far unexplained) appeals to masculinity isn't an explanation either.

The explanation, back in his very first post in the thread:

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Originally posted by Cluricaun

I asked my future father in law for his permission to marry his daughter because.....she wanted me to.

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[Bolding mine.]

He was respecting her wishes and those of her family. It was her choice, not some reenactment of marriage as property exchange. If a woman wants her husband to tie her up and spank her, I'm not about to go calling the guy a wife beater. And if a woman wants her fiance to ask for permission for her hand, I'm not going to accuse the guy of treating her like property. Her choice.

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Originally posted by Zuul

The explanation, back in his very first post in the thread:



[Bolding mine.]

He was respecting her wishes and those of her family. It was her choice, not some reenactment of marriage as property exchange. If a woman wants her husband to tie her up and spank her, I'm not about to go calling the guy a wife beater. And if a woman wants her fiance to ask for permission for her hand, I'm not going to accuse the guy of treating her like property. Her choice.

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Oh, I think I missed that.

It still raises the question of why in the hell she would want that but I guess he's not the one to answer.

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Originally posted by Exy

It still raises the question of why in the hell she would want that but I guess he's not the one to answer.

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Because her mom had died three months earlier and it was important to involve him in the fact that life will continue to move forward and have joy in it and that he was to play an integral part of all of this happening.

Nah, really it's just because I'm a Neanderthal.

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Originally posted by Zuul

It's not about the woman being property or anything sexist, at least not in this case. It's about showing respect. Cluricaun plans on marrying this woman, he asked her, and then he ensured that he had the blessing of his future father-in-law.

In some people's ideals, when you get married it isn't just you and your honey disappearing into the sunset together. It's about both families being joined through the union. His future wife's surviving parent is going to have an influence on their family.

He didn't get her dad's permission because he was taking his property. He did it because he was joining the family and this was a gesture to show that he was serious about being part of the family and would respect whatever traditions that family held. "Being a man" isn't about machismo, but about being a mature adult of the male persuasion.

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This is pretty much how I see it. When I got married, we both already knew that our families were happy about it. If I wasn't sure, though, or if there was some reason they had to be concerned, I think it's a good step for the guy to go and talk to her parents, like in the story I told about my friend.

If some guy went to the dad first and asked for the daughter's hand before proposing, that'd be pretty fucking creepy. But asking for the family's blessing after the engagement has already been set by the folks getting married doesn't strike me as sexist or anything silly like that. It's not a formality. Just a nice gesture.

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Originally posted by Zuul

It's not about the woman being property or anything sexist, at least not in this case. It's about showing respect. Cluricaun plans on marrying this woman, he asked her, and then he ensured that he had the blessing of his future father-in-law.

In some people's ideals, when you get married it isn't just you and your honey disappearing into the sunset together. It's about both families being joined through the union. His future wife's surviving parent is going to have an influence on their family.

He didn't get her dad's permission because he was taking his property. He did it because he was joining the family and this was a gesture to show that he was serious about being part of the family and would respect whatever traditions that family held. "Being a man" isn't about machismo, but about being a mature adult of the male persuasion.

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See, I can live with this - in fact, it's kind of sweet. But it still would not work for me. In my individual case, although I married my husband for love and not to escape home, in a larger sense it WAS part of my attempt to establish a life for myself that was totally separate from my parents.

To each his own, I guess - and I'm sure it is nice to have that warm a relationship with extended family. (I still think both sets of future in-laws should be asked by both the bride and groom, though -- that would be the logical follow-through from Zuul's reasoning.)