I Am Sick to Death of People Asking What's the Point to General Education

[OtakuLoki]

Case in point, I was just reading on some other place on the internet that someone is arguing that there's no need, purpose nor merit to cluttering up kids' minds with such trivia as the difference between deciduous and coniferous trees.

Since, of course, you don't need to use that in your day-to-day life once you leave school. Ergo it's useless.

Let's ignore, for the moment, that a failure to understand that difference is part of what informed this .

Fuck that. That's the fucking point.

If you don't know that some trees lose their leaves every year, and other trees don't, you're obviously a clueless asshole who has so little understanding of the world around you that you shouldn't be allowed to cross the street without a minder! For that matter, let's consider that currently many employers are complaining that they have to do what they consider remedial training when they get high school graduates. A local company makes milling machinery that is the standard for the industry. (Davenport Machines, Inc.) They cannot find enough qualified applicants for the positions they have to fill, because so many of the applicants they get can't do simple math, or understand the hazards of metalworking.

ISTM that the vast majority of the electorate has not only no recognition of the nation's history, but also no understanding of how the current system of government came to be, nor even what the limits and powers of the government are. And still people claim that history is a useless field of study, only applicable to some esoteric lunatics called historians.

Fuck you and your close-minded intellectual laziness. For that matter, go find some teat to suckle on, and stop talking in public. You have just proven you can't be trusted with anything as dangerous as an opinion, nor even a thought.




For the morbidly curious: The Dope thread that inspired this rant.

[ivan astikov]

I thought school was just an alternative to sending the little tykes up chimneys, and such?

[OtakuLoki]

School can fulfill more than one purpose at a time, ivan. Why not teach the little monsters something while preventing their parents from walling them into the chimney?

[What Exit?]

Our school systems get a hard time. I know NJ has excellent schools and it would not be hard to find high school grads that know basic math if they are offering a remotely decent wage, especially in today's economy. Such protest echo false to me or come from some of the dismal states or craptastic decaying cities.

However, I agree that history is relegated to the unimportant category by many school systems and vocational training somewhere along the way fell out of favor despite it being a great idea for the kids and industry.

Basic history and civics should be part of every kids education, though detailed dates and the like are not actually that useful except for trivia or a genuine interest by the student. I say this as someone that loves history.

Basic math is an absolute need and largely being met by most school systems to my knowledge. As is reading skills though more work in writing, spelling, typing and reading comprehension could always help.

As to idiots that protest against general education, well the Internet as great as it is has also given a platform to every crazy moron that use to be ignore in public places.

Loki, your state is surrounded by states that score great on education, how does NY state itself fair? I do not recall.

[jali]

I remember feeling this way while I was actually getting my general education. "Who needs these fucking theorums!"

I've been grateful to the Evil Nuns TM (grade school) and kind Brothers (HS) for my excellent general education ever since.

[Exy]

Oh my Christ, he actually did complain about having to learn "deciduous" and "coniferous". I figured you just made that up as an example.

I can't understand the attitude that it's not important to know anything about the world around us. We can quibble over the value of individual things kids learn -- I would also like to see teaching cursive handwriting disappear, personally -- but some people seem to think the only purpose of basic education is to train children up enough to be part of the economy. I think we should aspire to do more than teach our children to be good consumers, and hopefully inspire them to develop their natural curiosity about the world. We could probably teach all the kids all the skills that are universally expected by employers -- which basically boil down to the Three Rs -- by third grade. Why should we teach them all that stuff about "cells" and "atoms" and "Asia", right?

Man, I just do not understand that attitude.

[Taumpy]

Whatever happened to "And knowing is half the battle!"? You know what these kids need? GI Joe.

It does annoy me when people ask what the point of learning this or that is, because maybe the difference between deciduous and coniferous is useless in your everyday life, but maybe on one of those particular days it will be something you'll wish you learned about. And that really is the point of general education, hopefully teaching a kid enough of the basics of as many topics as possible, and hopefully they develop the desire to learn more on their own.

Something somewhat related that is a huge pet peeve of mine? Occasionally I'll refer to some fact or another in my daily conversations that is usually not obscure at all, and someone I'm talking to will say something to the effect of "why/how do you know that?" Why the fuck shouldn't I know it? I'm sorry that I'm able to retain knowledge beyond which celebrity is dating which.

[OtakuLoki]

Loki, your state is surrounded by states that score great on education, how does NY state itself fair? I do not recall.

AIUI, NY overall is doing reasonably well. Not great, but well enough. Having said that, locally the city schools are having real problems. This is exacerbated by the fact that Rochester is very much a former industrial city, with a growing emphasis on tech picking up some, but far from all, of the former employment opportunities for people.

That constriction is part of what's hitting places like Davenport - they still get a huge number of applicants for their positions when they do announce openings. But they have to wade through hundreds of applicants per position to find suitable ones. (This was a couple years ago, too - not a reflection of the current economic crisis.) I'm sure that increased remuneration would be able to improve the candidate pool, but it's not the sole issue.

[RabbitMage]

God forbid we teach our children about the world around them and this expand their understanding, or guide them in using logic and reasoning to give them the ability to figure out things we don't have time to teach them.

Unfortunately, due to circumstances (read: NCLB) that kind of thing often gets pushed to the wayside. If it's not on the test, there's no time for it.

[Inner Stickler]

But how else would we get funny blog posts like Creationist almost discovers the sun?