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Thread: Pros and cons of revolvers and semiautomatic handguns

  1. #1
    Oliphaunt
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    Default Pros and cons of revolvers and semiautomatic handguns

    I've always thought that revolvers are loud, prone to failure and slow to reload when compared to semiautomatic handguns, which was why the latter were invented in the first place. Here and there I pick up the notion that revolvers are more accurate, more reliable and less prone to failure. What's the inside scoop, and what's the point of semiautomatics?

  2. #2
    Stegodon Dragon's avatar
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    Default Re: Pros and cons of revolvers and semiautomatic handguns

    Just something to note while people give their opinions....
    Revolvers are slow? Hummmm
    No job is too hard for the person who does not have to do it.

  3. #3
    I've had better days, but I don't care! hatesfreedom's avatar
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    Default Re: Pros and cons of revolvers and semiautomatic handguns

    revolvers have less parts. semiautomatics have more bullets. and there's no reason to care about pistol accuracy.

    look how easy that was.

  4. #4
    aka ivan the not-quite-as-terrible ivan astikov's avatar
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    Default Re: Pros and cons of revolvers and semiautomatic handguns

    Quote Originally posted by Dragon
    Just something to note while people give their opinions....
    Revolvers are slow? Hummmm
    What was happening there? Was he pulling the trigger seperately for each shot? If so, how in hell do you do that without practising an inordinately excessive amount of times? Or could it be done in a hour a day over 40 years?

    And who is he expecting to bump into?
    To sleep, perchance to experience amygdalocortical activation and prefrontal deactivation.

  5. #5
    Free Exy Cluricaun's avatar
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    Default Re: Pros and cons of revolvers and semiautomatic handguns

    Define “prone to failure”. Automatics tend to have higher rates of misfire and stoppage than a revolver simply because a revolver has less moving parts, hence less opportunity for malfunction. Hatesfreedom pretty much nailed it. Most people who carry for a living like an automatic for high capacity, but have a wheelgun tucked away as a backup because 99.9% of the time when you pull the trigger it goes bang.
    Hell, if I didn't do things just because they made me feel a bit ridiculous, I wouldn't have much of a social life. - Santo Rugger.

  6. #6
    Elephant
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    Default Re: Pros and cons of revolvers and semiautomatic handguns

    Quote Originally posted by Cluricaun
    Define “prone to failure”. Automatics tend to have higher rates of misfire and stoppage than a revolver simply because a revolver has less moving parts, hence less opportunity for malfunction.
    That's not really true so much anymore. Most malfuntions nowadays occur due to defects in the cartridge, not the gun (assuming, of course a properly-maintained weapon). The thing is, when that happens with a revolver, you just pull the trigger again and fire the next round; with an auto, you have to first clear the jam by racking the slide before you can fire again.

  7. #7
    Stegodon
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    Default Re: Pros and cons of revolvers and semiautomatic handguns

    One other advantage of revolvers is that they will function with a wider range of loads. Autoloaders are designed to optimally function with cartridges within certain projectile weights and pressure ranges. If you stray too far outside those limits you start getting malfunctions of different kinds. With revolvers, you have much wider latitude since the cartridge only has to drive the projectile out the barrel. As long as you do that but don't overload to where you blow the gun up, the revolver will function. Some loads will, of course, perform better than others for a given purpose.

  8. #8
    Free Exy Cluricaun's avatar
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    Default Re: Pros and cons of revolvers and semiautomatic handguns

    Many automatics are notoriously picky about what kind of ammo will cycle reliably and not cause stoppages. It’s not due to any particular defect in the cartridge itself, but the tolerances of the particular gun itself. Plenty of shooters know that even differing powder loads in otherwise identical cartridges can cause wildly different levels of reliability in a particular gun and will have to experiment with, er, loads of different loads before they find one that is the right one.. A revolver has none of that. You load it, it goes.

    ETA- Beaten by Scumpup.
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  9. #9
    Stegodon
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    Default Re: Pros and cons of revolvers and semiautomatic handguns

    Automatics: More rounds available, more rounds downrange when you need firepower, faster reloading, more extra ammo available. It combines intimidation and suppressing fire in one weapon. A comparison would be using a bolt action rifle in combat vs a semi-auto rifle.
    I am not a professional chef, but I dress like one at home.

  10. #10
    Stegodon
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    Default Re: Pros and cons of revolvers and semiautomatic handguns

    Revolvers are also safer to keep in a ready-to-fire state. You can have the hammer sitting on an empty chamber in a revolver, and there is absolutely no way dropping it could cause it to fire, yet all you would have to do to make it fire is pull the trigger. To get that level of safety in an automatic, you would have to keep the chamber empty, which would mean you'd have to rack the slide before firing. To have it so all you have to do is pull the trigger, you would have to keep a bullet in the firing chamber. Even with the safety on, there is a chance the gun will go off if it is jarred the right way if there's a round in the chamber, though some guns have better safeties than others.

  11. #11
    I've had better days, but I don't care! hatesfreedom's avatar
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    Default Re: Pros and cons of revolvers and semiautomatic handguns

    Quote Originally posted by Badtz Maru
    Revolvers are also safer to keep in a ready-to-fire state. You can have the hammer sitting on an empty chamber in a revolver, and there is absolutely no way dropping it could cause it to fire, yet all you would have to do to make it fire is pull the trigger. To get that level of safety in an automatic, you would have to keep the chamber empty, which would mean you'd have to rack the slide before firing. To have it so all you have to do is pull the trigger, you would have to keep a bullet in the firing chamber. Even with the safety on, there is a chance the gun will go off if it is jarred the right way if there's a round in the chamber, though some guns have better safeties than others.
    The glock trigger safety is pretty darn good. I just thought I'd throw that out there for no reason.

  12. #12
    Stegodon
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    Default Re: Pros and cons of revolvers and semiautomatic handguns

    Quote Originally posted by Badtz Maru
    Revolvers are also safer to keep in a ready-to-fire state. You can have the hammer sitting on an empty chamber in a revolver, and there is absolutely no way dropping it could cause it to fire, yet all you would have to do to make it fire is pull the trigger. To get that level of safety in an automatic, you would have to keep the chamber empty, which would mean you'd have to rack the slide before firing. To have it so all you have to do is pull the trigger, you would have to keep a bullet in the firing chamber. Even with the safety on, there is a chance the gun will go off if it is jarred the right way if there's a round in the chamber, though some guns have better safeties than others.
    That's not always true, anymore. Many modern automatic pistols have multiple internal safeties that make it impossible to fire without proper pull of trigger. For example Glocks mentioned by hatesfreedom have trigger mechanism that keeps striker not fully cocked until trigger is pulled, and also kept in a position that prevents it from striking even under severe mechanical shocks (like dropping it from height). Similar mechanical safeties are quite common in modern handguns, though it was different in the past (and still is different for cheap automatics).

  13. #13
    Maximum Proconsul silenus's avatar
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    Default Re: Pros and cons of revolvers and semiautomatic handguns

    Revolvers tend to have a thicker profile than a semiautomatic. When concealability is an issue, semis are generally favored. As for accuracy...if what you are shooting at is more than 15 feet from you, why are you shooting at it? Within that range it doesn't matter.
    "The Turtle Moves!"

  14. #14
    Stegodon
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    Default Re: Pros and cons of revolvers and semiautomatic handguns

    Quote Originally posted by silenus
    Revolvers tend to have a thicker profile than a semiautomatic. When concealability is an issue, semis are generally favored. As for accuracy...if what you are shooting at is more than 15 feet from you, why are you shooting at it? Within that range it doesn't matter.
    Some states have a pistols-only hunting season. There is also target shooting. There's reasons to own a pistol other than self-defense.

    And 15 feet is a bit on the close side for self-defense. If you have a large house, you might want a bit more accuracy if you are a good enough shot to aim for vital organs.

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    Default Re: Pros and cons of revolvers and semiautomatic handguns

    As an owner of both, I have to agree with many of the points already stated. My Smith 10mm has never had a misfeed, but my Grendel .380 does get cranky with some brands of ammo. The biggest difference I've noted is that it takes 3x as long to clean my stainless Taurus .44 revolver as it does for either pistol. All those little nooks and crannies in a wheel gun are a bugger.
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    Default Re: Pros and cons of revolvers and semiautomatic handguns

    Quote Originally posted by danceswithcats
    ...my Grendel .380 does get cranky with some brands of ammo.
    I dunno how the market is around you, but around here that's not a problem--there isn't any. I just picked up a little .380 auto and no one...I mean NO ONE...around here has .380 ACP. Sheesh.

  17. #17
    Elephant
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    Default Re: Pros and cons of revolvers and semiautomatic handguns

    My big long post this morning was eaten by trolls. I pushed submit and the entire board disappeared and could not be re-accessed. Dammit.

    All of the above.

    When I have all the time in the world and accuracy is the primary need, I'll take my .357 revolver with the 6" barrel every time. When I need those rounds flying NOW, I'll choose my 9mm.

    Carried my 9mm when I worked Armored because I've had it for 19 years and it has never malfunctioned or misfed. The .357 would have been too big and heavy to carry every day. My .40 has a distressing tendency to be very picky about ammo (and I had to use company supplied) and stovepipe stuff it doesn't like. No way I'd bet my life on that gun.

    My partner carried a .357 with a 3" barrel, and only 12 rounds of ammo. I carried only one clip of 15. We both had the philosophy - unlike virtually all of our co-workers - that shootouts were highly improbable and that if we couldn't get out of it with the rounds we had, then we weren't getting out of it with any amount of ammo.
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  18. #18
    Stegodon
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    Default Re: Pros and cons of revolvers and semiautomatic handguns

    Tiny revolvers are unquestionably more reliable than tiny autos. I own bunches of high quality handguns, and my "always" gun is a S&W Chiefs Special. A 30 year old one at that. I keep it loaded with premium +P hollopoints. This gun is one I settled on as the most acceptable combination of size. weight, power, and reliability. It virtually guarantees 5 shots of reasonably effective ammo from a platform that will fit comfortably into the pocket of almost all my pants and slacks. Autos in the same size range are simply not as dead nuts reliable IME. When you need a defensive gun, you need one that is going to work.

  19. #19
    Free Exy Cluricaun's avatar
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    Default Re: Pros and cons of revolvers and semiautomatic handguns

    It's also a price contention, I've heard great things about the tiny .45s that Kimber and Wilson are able to crank out, but I ask myself, self, would we really pay $2300 for a backup gun? No we would not as it turns out. Not when we can have ourselves a nice hammerless Smith in .38 for around $300.

    Besides, when I get my druthers in the next month or so, I'll have my mitts on a Springfield XDm in 9mm. Sucker holds 20 goddamned rounds, no kidding. If you're packed with one in the pipe and an extra clip you get an increadible 39 shots that can be let go in or around 10 seconds. Yow.
    Hell, if I didn't do things just because they made me feel a bit ridiculous, I wouldn't have much of a social life. - Santo Rugger.

  20. #20
    Elephant
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    Default Re: Pros and cons of revolvers and semiautomatic handguns

    Well, I DO have a 30-round clip for my Taurus PT99.
    I reserve the right to be bothered by things that don't faze you,
    and to cheerfully ignore things that bug the shit out of you.
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  21. #21
    Elephant
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    Default Re: Pros and cons of revolvers and semiautomatic handguns

    Quote Originally posted by Q.E.D.
    Quote Originally posted by danceswithcats
    ...my Grendel .380 does get cranky with some brands of ammo.
    I dunno how the market is around you, but around here that's not a problem--there isn't any. I just picked up a little .380 auto and no one...I mean NO ONE...around here has .380 ACP. Sheesh.
    Wow. I'll have to look. When I see a good price, I'll buy 10 bricks.

    Well, heck. A few calls indicate the only thing in stock around here is .38SP. The guy at Mall-Wart said he got two cases of 9mm the other day and they were gone in 24 hours. Nuts.
    Opportunity is missed by most people, because it is dressed in overalls and looks like work. Thomas Edison

  22. #22
    Elephant
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    Default Re: Pros and cons of revolvers and semiautomatic handguns

    Yeah, I picked the wrong caliber, apparently.

  23. #23
    Elephant
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    Default Re: Pros and cons of revolvers and semiautomatic handguns

    Quote Originally posted by Q.E.D.
    Yeah, I picked the wrong caliber, apparently.
    Nothing wrong with .380 ACP. Many good, small, self-defense weapons are made in that caliber. I'd give it a few months for the market to settle out and then we'll have supply back where it was.

    I've a good supply of saved brass, but haven't been willing to make the investment in reloading. :wink:

    ETA: Is that Pepper?
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    Maximum Proconsul silenus's avatar
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    Default Re: Pros and cons of revolvers and semiautomatic handguns

    It's a toss-up which I'd reach for in the middle of the night - the .357 or the 9mm. Both reside within easy reach of my side of the bed, and both are kept loaded. I'd probably go for the .357, because it is sequentially loaded. First .38 wadcutters, then +P .38 hollowpoints, then 128 grain .357 hollowpoints. The first loads are much lower in flash, so they won't kick out fireballs that destroy night vision. That gives me more aimed shots.

    Pistol-only hunting is as stupid as bow & arrow hunting.
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  25. #25
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    Default Re: Pros and cons of revolvers and semiautomatic handguns

    Quote Originally posted by danceswithcats
    Quote Originally posted by Q.E.D.
    Yeah, I picked the wrong caliber, apparently.
    Nothing wrong with .380 ACP. Many good, small, self-defense weapons are made in that caliber.
    Oh, I didn't mean it that way; I have no problems with the round itself. It's the availability issue, is all.

    Quote Originally posted by danceswithcats
    ETA: Is that Pepper?
    Yep. Deeply inhaling her catnip mousie. I got me a little druggie in the house, evidently.

    ETA: And other than cropping and brightness/contrast/color balance tweaking, it's entirely unedited.

  26. #26
    Elephant
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    Default Re: Pros and cons of revolvers and semiautomatic handguns

    Quote Originally posted by silenus
    Pistol-only hunting is as stupid as bow & arrow hunting.
    No offense, really, but the only stupid thing is this comment. It's not for you, fine, but don't go pissing in other people's pools just because you don't understand it.

  27. #27
    Elephant
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    Default Re: Pros and cons of revolvers and semiautomatic handguns

    Well damned straight the .357 is the "house gun". Nothing says "Those who are still alive and don't belong here should get the fuck out of my house if you know what is good for you" like a nice solid .357 flavored BOOM in the middle of the night.

    And nothing chased off the five people attempting to break into my old house while I was there quite like the sight of that thing held up for maximized clear viewing.
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  28. #28
    Free Exy Cluricaun's avatar
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    Default Re: Pros and cons of revolvers and semiautomatic handguns

    Something is going on with .380. I went to Cheaper than Dirt to try and find a bargain to link to...........everything is out of stock except blanks. What the deuce is going on?
    Hell, if I didn't do things just because they made me feel a bit ridiculous, I wouldn't have much of a social life. - Santo Rugger.

  29. #29
    Elephant
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    Default Re: Pros and cons of revolvers and semiautomatic handguns

    Quote Originally posted by Q.E.D.

    Quote Originally posted by danceswithcats
    ETA: Is that Pepper?
    Yep. Deeply inhaling her catnip mousie. I got me a little druggie in the house, evidently.

    ETA: And other than cropping and brightness/contrast/color balance tweaking, it's entirely unedited.
    Cute little furhead.
    Opportunity is missed by most people, because it is dressed in overalls and looks like work. Thomas Edison

  30. #30
    Elephant
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    Default Re: Pros and cons of revolvers and semiautomatic handguns

    The shops I called today told me people were just buying them up like nuts and the manufacturers were having trouble keeping up with demand. It's "available" but if you aren't fortunate enough to hit a store within a few hours after it puts some on the shelves, you're SOL. Why? I have no fucking clue.

  31. #31
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    Default Re: Pros and cons of revolvers and semiautomatic handguns

    Quote Originally posted by Cluricaun
    Something is going on with .380. I went to Cheaper than Dirt to try and find a bargain to link to...........everything is out of stock except blanks. What the deuce is going on?
    There was a story on NPR about ammunition shortages, and I figured it was limited to long gun calibers, until I saw Q.E.D.'s post, and made some calls.
    Opportunity is missed by most people, because it is dressed in overalls and looks like work. Thomas Edison

  32. #32
    Elephant
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    Default Re: Pros and cons of revolvers and semiautomatic handguns

    Nah, everyone is worried about Obama pulling some drastic anti-gun measure; along with, to a lesser extent, general fears about the economy (more poor people = more crime).
    I reserve the right to be bothered by things that don't faze you,
    and to cheerfully ignore things that bug the shit out of you.
    I am not you.

  33. #33
    Elephant
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    Default Re: Pros and cons of revolvers and semiautomatic handguns

    Update: on a whim, I called the guy I bought the auto from to see if he had any leftover .380 ammo. And damned if he didn't. Yay!

  34. #34
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    Default Re: Pros and cons of revolvers and semiautomatic handguns

    Quote Originally posted by Badtz Maru
    Revolvers are also safer to keep in a ready-to-fire state. You can have the hammer sitting on an empty chamber in a revolver, and there is absolutely no way dropping it could cause it to fire, yet all you would have to do to make it fire is pull the trigger. To get that level of safety in an automatic, you would have to keep the chamber empty, which would mean you'd have to rack the slide before firing. To have it so all you have to do is pull the trigger, you would have to keep a bullet in the firing chamber. Even with the safety on, there is a chance the gun will go off if it is jarred the right way if there's a round in the chamber, though some guns have better safeties than others.
    This is simply not true. All modern [good quality] autopistols have one or more passive safeties that prevent discharge unless the trigger is actually pulled. The same is true of modern revolvers, which use a transfer bar or some other passive safety to prevent discharge.

    Some autoloaders can be picky about feeding, which is why it is important (with a defensive arm) to run at least a few magazines of the ammo you intend to use to confirm reliability; however, most good quality pistols have little or no problem feeding factory hollowpoint rounds. Stovepiping--the fired cartridge getting caught in the eject port--is a more common failure mode, usually due to a worn ejector spring or damaged ejector arm. In either case, the standard "Tap, rack, bang" (TRB) drill takes only a couple of seconds. On occasion, some rounds will fail to fire because of a light primer strike. TRB will rectify this, and and double action (DA) or double action only (DAO) can repeat fire without doing even this, which will generally cause the round to fire. One other significant failure mode of autos is the magazine coming loose, which is a notable problem on some models (although typically with non-OEM magazines). This can be fixed with minor gunsmithing or an aftermarket magazine catch.

    Revolvers, on the other hand, have the fairly delicate cylinder and locking system exposed to damage which can jam the gun up completely requiring the services of a gunsmith to rectify. I know several autopistol designs which can and have been run over by trucks, buried in mud, et cetera, and function flawlessly afterward. I can't imagine a any revolver--even one of those tanks built by Ruger--that could withstand such treatment and function reliably.

    By virtue of having a fixed barrel revolvers are generally more accurate than a recoil operated pistol of the same barrel length. (A few pistols use gas retarded delayed blowback or roller locking and therefore have a fixed barrel, but most have some kind of tilting or rotating action which can contribute some amount of difference shot to shot.) However, as pointed out above, for all practical (defensive) purposes it doesn't really matter as the accuracy under combat conditions makes the inherent accuracy of the pistol noise. Also, many pistols, such as the Sig and Glocks, demonstrate out of the box accuracy and consistency that rivals fixed barrel revolvers. Ditto for firing speed; the recoil of a defensive caliber pistol is going to require more time to recover than the fire-and-feed sequence of any automatic.

    For any practical defensive use, I would select a good quality automatic (Sig Sauer or H&K) over a revolver any day of the week. The only real advantage of a revolver is the basic simplicity of operation, i.e. there are two controls--the trigger and the cylinder release, versus a trigger, slide and slide lock, magazine catch, and combinations of decocker or manual safety. Under stress simplicity is key; but I think it only requires a moderate amount of additional training to master the handling of an autoloader under stress beyond basic handgun competency and marksmanship.

    Stranger
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  35. #35
    Stegodon Boozahol Squid, P.I.'s avatar
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    Default Re: Pros and cons of revolvers and semiautomatic handguns

    [quote="Stranger On A TrainUnder stress simplicity is key; but I think it only requires a moderate amount of additional training to master the handling of an autoloader under stress beyond basic handgun competency and marksmanship. [/quote]

    When I first read this, I thought by 'autoloader', you were referring to full-moon clips. I was about to ask what sort of stresses you might imagine getting into where reloading was an issue. :smile:

  36. #36
    Stegodon
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    Default Re: Pros and cons of revolvers and semiautomatic handguns

    For any practical defensive use, I would select a good quality automatic (Sig Sauer or H&K) over a revolver any day of the week. The only real advantage of a revolver is the basic simplicity of operation, i.e. there are two controls--the trigger and the cylinder release, versus a trigger, slide and slide lock, magazine catch, and combinations of decocker or manual safety. Under stress simplicity is key; but I think it only requires a moderate amount of additional training to master the handling of an autoloader under stress beyond basic handgun competency and marksmanship.

    Stranger
    I will agree provided that we are talking about mid-size or full size autoaders and revolvers. For the guns at the pocketsize end of the scale, I still maintain that revolvers have a distinct edge in reliability. As Cluricaun pointed out, there is also a degree of cost-effectiveness favoring revolvers.

    The autoloaders that I can think of that are truly equal to a J-frame Smith and Wesson in terms of ease of carry and concealability are few. Of those few that do exist, most use cartridges that are inferior to the .38/.357. No handgun is a sure stopper, but I'd rather have 5 premium .38's that I'm sure will fire than six or seven .32 acp's or .380 acp's that I'm almost sure will fire. The truly pocket size 9 mm's are either questionable (Keltec PF9) or insanely expensive (Rorhbaugh) and finicky about ammo.

    If we're talking about the microguns, I'd prefer a NAA minirevolver in .22 magnum over any teeny tiny .22 or .25 autoloader ever made.

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    Default Re: Pros and cons of revolvers and semiautomatic handguns

    Quote Originally posted by Q.E.D.
    Update: on a whim, I called the guy I bought the auto from to see if he had any leftover .380 ammo. And damned if he didn't. Yay!
    You'll want to keep that handy. I'm worried we're all going to need it soon.

  38. #38
    Aged Turtle Wizard Clothahump's avatar
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    Default Re: Pros and cons of revolvers and semiautomatic handguns

    Quote Originally posted by Chimera
    We both had the philosophy - unlike virtually all of our co-workers - that shootouts were highly improbable and that if we couldn't get out of it with the rounds we had, then we weren't getting out of it with any amount of ammo.
    Agreed. During the entire time I worked in law enforcement or private security, I carried an S&W model 15, loaded with 6, and 12 rounds on the belt that were pretty much window dressing. If I couldn't get the job done with the 6 on board, I probably wasn't going to get a chance to reload.
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  39. #39
    Oliphaunt
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    Default Re: Pros and cons of revolvers and semiautomatic handguns

    Just so noone thinks the OP disappeared, I'm reading with great interest.

  40. #40
    Stegodon
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    Default Re: Pros and cons of revolvers and semiautomatic handguns

    I like the simplicity of a revolver, myself, and also I like knowing that if I get my hands wrong it's a lot harder to fuck my thumb up with one. Just my personal opinion. I decided the tradeoff of fewer rounds was worth it, as I don't carry and distances inside my house, the only place I'd probably need to shoot it, are quite short. I believe I could hit anything I needed to hit coming through the bedroom door given five shots.
    "I'll be more enthusiastic about encouraging thinking outside the box when there's evidence of any thinking going on inside it."
    -- Terry Pratchett

  41. #41
    Arms of Steel, Leg of Jello runner pat's avatar
    Registered
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Turlock, Ca
    Posts
    205

    Default Re: Pros and cons of revolvers and semiautomatic handguns

    Every revolver I've ever handled feels the same, all the weight hanging beyond my hand, just never liked the feel.
    My Glock is as simple as a revolver and feels right in my hand.
    Still, to each his own, I won't presume to tell anyone else what to shoot.
    "To give anything less than your best is to waste the Gift."
    Steve Prefontaine

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